Cooking with Alcohol (for Sign)

[hiccups]

I came across an interesting article on how alcohol doesn't really cook off as much as people tend to believe. It reminded me of an old conversation with Sign on another board, but I thought others might find it of interest as well.

http://www.ochef.com/165.htm


Does Alcohol Really Boil Away in Cooking?
http://www.ochef.com/images/Q.gif How long does it take for alcohol to burn off during cooking? Is this time the same for all forms of alcohol? Boil? Simmer? How about in baking?
http://www.ochef.com/images/A.gif Yours may be the question of the year. We thought it was pretty cut and dried. We were wrong. And it has taken a while for us to accept what we’ve found out.


We started looking through a bunch of authoritative cookbooks to see what they said. In The New Making of a Cook (http://www.amazon.com/dp/0688152546?tag=ochefcom-20&link_code=as3&creativeASIN=0688152546&creative=373489&camp=211189) (Canada (http://www.amazon.ca/dp/0688152546?tag=ochefcom01-20&link_code=as2&creativeASIN=0688152546&creative=374929&camp=211189), UK (http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/0688152546?tag=ochefcom-21&link_code=as2&creativeASIN=0688152546&creative=374929&camp=211189)), as authoritative a source as you can find, Madeleine Kamman cautions that a dish with wine must be cooked long enough to remove the harshness of the alcohol. In fact, she wants you to simmer and reduce the wine separately from the sauce, and add it only when it has been gently reduced to its essence. She does not say how long that takes, however.
Two dozen other major cookbooks we looked at did not address the issue at all. Several stated that the alcohol burns off, but no one took a stab at how quickly or slowly that happens. We looked in our favorite food science books. Nothing. Finally, James Peterson, a cookbook writer who studied chemistry at the University of California at Berkeley, mentioned it in his encyclopedic cookbook, Sauces (http://www.amazon.com/dp/0471292753?tag=ochefcom-20&link_code=as3&creativeASIN=0471292753&creative=373489&camp=211189) (Canada (http://www.amazon.ca/dp/0471292753?tag=ochefcom01-20&link_code=as2&creativeASIN=0471292753&creative=374929&camp=211189), UK (http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/0471292753?tag=ochefcom-21&link_code=as2&creativeASIN=0471292753&creative=374929&camp=211189)). He says you need to cook a sauce for at least 20 to 30 seconds after adding wine to it to allow the alcohol to evaporate. And there is some sense to that, since alcohol evaporates at 172°F (78°C), so any sauce or stew that is simmering (http://www.ochef.com/736.htm) or boiling is certainly hot enough to evaporate the alcohol.
We still weren’t satisfied though. We recalled that when we flambéed foods, it often takes at least a minute for the flames to die out, a sign to us that most of the alcohol is gone. So we dug around online, and got in touch with various government agencies and trade groups that represent wine and spirits manufacturers.
What we found out has really surprised us. The conventional wisdom accepted by just about everyone in the food world is that all the alcohol you add to a dish evaporates or dissipates during cooking. It’s wrong. In fact, you have to cook something for a good three hours to eradicate virtually all traces of alcohol. And some cooking methods are less effective at removing alcohol than just letting it stand out uncovered overnight.
A study conducted by the US Department of Agriculture’s Nutrient Data Laboratory calculated the percentage of alcohol remaining in a dish based on various cooking methods. The results are as follows:
<TABLE border=1 width="100%" height=301><TBODY><TR><TH height=19 width="11%">Preparation Method</TH><TH height=19 width="11%" align=middle>Percent of Alcohol Retained</TH></TR><TR><TD height=19 width="11%">alcohol added to boiling liquid & removed from heat</TD><TD height=19 width="11%" align=middle>85%</TD></TR><TR><TD height=19 width="11%">alcohol flamed</TD><TD height=19 width="11%" align=middle>75%</TD></TR><TR><TD height=19 width="11%">no heat, stored overnight</TD><TD height=19 width="11%" align=middle>70%</TD></TR><TR><TD height=19 width="11%">baked, 25 minutes, alcohol not stirred into mixture</TD><TD height=19 width="11%" align=middle>45%</TD></TR><TR><TD height=19 width="11%">baked/simmered, alcohol stirred into mixture:</TD><TD height=19 width="11%" align=middle></TD></TR><TR><TD height=19 width="11%">

15 minutes
</TD><TD height=19 vAlign=top width="11%" align=middle>40%</TD></TR><TR><TD height=19 width="11%">

30 minutes
</TD><TD height=19 vAlign=top width="11%" align=middle>35%</TD></TR><TR><TD height=19 width="11%">

1 hour
</TD><TD height=19 vAlign=top width="11%" align=middle>25%</TD></TR><TR><TD height=19 width="11%">

1.5 hours
</TD><TD height=19 vAlign=top width="11%" align=middle>20%</TD></TR><TR><TD height=19 width="11%">

2 hours
</TD><TD height=19 vAlign=top width="11%" align=middle>10%</TD></TR><TR><TD height=19 width="11%">

2.5 hours
</TD><TD height=19 vAlign=top width="11%" align=middle>5%</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
Now, it may be that the amount of alcohol in a dish is modest to start with, but the fact that some of the alcohol remains could be of significant concern to recovering alcoholics, parents, and others who have ethical or religious reasons for avoiding alcohol. Madeleine Kamman, James Peterson and some of our other cooking heroes may be on the mark when stating that the harshness of the alcohol burns off quickly. But the alcohol itself is clearly another matter.

[Babbi-Dan]

All of my extracts have alcohol in them, as does cough syrup. I suppose if you were going to drown your meal with alcohol while cooking then there would be cause of concern. However, the occasional 2 Tablespoons or 1/2 cup added to a huge pot of something doesn't bother me in the least. Maybe it should, I don't know.

I do know there was a guy in our church that refused to accept several prescriptions from his doctor because they contained caffeine. Drove his doctor nuts trying to find a medication that would work that did not have caffeine.

[signseeker]

Oh, for the love of Pete. I put a disclaimer on all my brownies and black bottom cakes whenever we have a potluck ward dinner. And the Market Street clam chowder. And the beef stew. And the chili. No one seems to blink... they all just gobble it down. And what's weird... the most spiritual people eat the most! You think I'm making this up? It's true. It's like they are drawn to it somehow - you ought to just sit back and watch it sometime. Fascinating. If Brigham Young were in my ward today, he'd totally be digging on my clam chowder. Big time. Don't even kid yourself.

[signseeker]

WHOA! Gimme my yellow bird back NOW!!! Flippin' hypocrits.

[Lucy]

As long as we're talking about "stuff" What is the prevailing wisdom on Green Tea? Is it or isn't it against the Word of Wisdom. (for those who may not know, it's the new "diet drug" er drink)

[JayE]

As long as we're talking about "stuff" What is the prevailing wisdom on Green Tea? Is it or isn't it against the Word of Wisdom. (for those who may not know, it's the new "diet drug" er drink)

For me, there is no difference between black tea and green tea, as far as the WoW. They come from the same plant, and according to my stake president, green tea is against the WoW, the same as black tea.

[signseeker]

If it's kind of a golden-amber color, though, it's all good. :thumbsup:

[hiccups]

Oh, for the love of Pete. I put a disclaimer on all my brownies and black bottom cakes whenever we have a potluck ward dinner. And the Market Street clam chowder. And the beef stew. And the chili. No one seems to blink... they all just gobble it down. And what's weird... the most spiritual people eat the most! You think I'm making this up? It's true. It's like they are drawn to it somehow - you ought to just sit back and watch it sometime. Fascinating. If Brigham Young were in my ward today, he'd totally be digging on my clam chowder. Big time. Don't even kid yourself.

Simmer down, Sign. If you recall, I wasn't against cooking with alcohol. I just thought this was good information to know.

[signseeker]

Simmer down... as long as it's more than 2 hours? :l0 (53):

[ktcottle]

I haven't laughed this hard in a long time! Thanks all for being this funny - probably without trying to be.

[phylm]

For me, there is no difference between black tea and green tea, as far as the WoW. They come from the same plant, and according to my stake president, green tea is against the WoW, the same as black tea.

As long as we're confessing...I have black tea in my medical storage. It is great--quick and effective--for diarrhea treatment. Had a one-cup dose tonight before I left for my prep-teaching class. (Was in real distress, and it worked!) I do refuse to add cream and sugar as I used to do. Black, it is indeed medicine. Don't often have to use it, but it sure is handy when needed.

[signseeker]

Maybe some feel like death by diarrhea is a more noble way to go than (gasp) breaking the WOW.

(Just messin' witcha, Jay. Err-- your SP, actually.)

[ZDMZ]

On my mission in Korea we drank a lot of barley tea. They put barley in the water that had been boiled so they knew which water was safe to drink. It was pretty rare to find just "water" to drink.
We also drank some jinseng teas but we avoided the black teas.

As far as the alcohol goes, I have a small alcohol stove for camping - it holds maybe an ounce of alcohol and takes about 5-7 minutes to burn completely. Enough time to boil a couple cups of water. I think that is quite a long time.

I'm not suprised that the percentages of alcohol left behind while cooking. It doesn't bother me.
I guess it is a letter of the law vs spirit of the law thing.
Are there extra blessing for letter of the law-ers?:o11:

[Noahs ARK]

Oh, for the love of Pete. I put a disclaimer on all my brownies and black bottom cakes whenever we have a potluck ward dinner. And the Market Street clam chowder. And the beef stew. And the chili. No one seems to blink... they all just gobble it down. And what's weird... the most spiritual people eat the most! You think I'm making this up? It's true. It's like they are drawn to it somehow - you ought to just sit back and watch it sometime. Fascinating. If Brigham Young were in my ward today, he'd totally be digging on my clam chowder. Big time. Don't even kid yourself.

:frown2:

I'm telling!! I don't know WHO I'm gonna tell, but I am.

Signed.....:a0 (26):

[LarnaE]

As long as we're confessing...I have black tea in my medical storage. It is great--quick and effective--for diarrhea treatment. Had a one-cup dose tonight before I left for my prep-teaching class. (Was in real distress, and it worked!) I do refuse to add cream and sugar as I used to do. Black, it is indeed medicine. Don't often have to use it, but it sure is handy when needed.

My mom use to give me black tea when I had diarrhea, It tastes horrible. I could never understand how people could drink it for pleasure, but it did work. She also gave me paragoric, that is also nasty stuff.

[LarnaE]

Sometimes It is better if you don't know what is in your food. My companion and I ate a big box of rum chocolates that an investigator gave us. It was so yummy. We later found out that there was alcohol in them. We were so sad. We wanted more.

[sarge712]

No caffeine in his meds??? Oh brother! I love messing with the "No Caffeine" Nazi's. I bring in Pepsi's and Mountain Dews to ward cookouts just because. I once had to sit on a cooler to keep one from tossing out the caffeinated drinks that an investigator brought. Talk about choking on a gnat...and this guy and his wife never met a dozen doughnuts they didn't inhale. I think overeating / poor diet eclipses tea or coffee as a health threat and is as bad as alcohol in the end when you consider the effect is has on quality of life in the later years.

[Noahs ARK]

Sometimes It is better if you don't know what is in your food. My companion and I ate a big box of rum chocolates that an investigator gave us. It was so yummy. We later found out that there was alcohol in them. We were so sad. We wanted more.

My mom got a fruitcake for Christmas one year - we both love fruitcake.

Anyhoo - she'd been eating it for a couple of days and when I ate a piece, I said "this has rum or whiskey or SOMEthing in it."

Oh my gosh - she thought her Temple Recommend was gonna get revoked. :l0 (43):

[ZDMZ]

Went on a camp once to an old ranchhouse that was used during calving season. The cooks were setting up in the kitchen and started to dump out bottles of "libations" that were there.
We had to tell them to stop it because we were guests there and that stuff was not theirs to dump out.
They were convinced that some of the youth would get into the kitchen and drink it up. :party:

[KF7EEC]

Went on a camp once to an old ranchhouse that was used during calving season. The cooks were setting up in the kitchen and started to dump out bottles of "libations" that were there.
We had to tell them to stop it because we were guests there and that stuff was not theirs to dump out.
They were convinced that some of the youth would get into the kitchen and drink it up. :party:

"I teach the [youth] correct principles and allow them to govern themselves..."

[Baconator]

The only impairment I've suffered from beef bourguignon is from eating too much of it. Yum!
A red wine, garlic and onion reduction can do amazing things to beef!

[ghostcat]

A red wine, garlic and onion reduction can do amazing things to beef!
I've heard that is true of horse meat as well. :beatdeadhorse5::rofl:

[prairiemom]

I suppose I better keep quiet about the bottles of rum and vodka that I have for making tinctures.:leaving:

[Babbi-Dan]

I have used a weak cup of Lipton tea (orange pekoe, decaffeinated) to help with an upset stomach. Sipping a weak cup of tea with a touch of sugar in it will settle an upset stomach. I only use it for medicinal purposes, but it really works.